RS Media Fried electronics

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Helibot
Helibot's picture

 

Jamie said: Hello Helibot, I didn't use any tcp to serial programs. I just used the stock standard USBnet console drivers you made and used TeraTerm to connect to the usb2tcp port. 127.0.0.1:222 It "Just works" - No need for other programs that don't do much at all. That clears for how I used the USB console on Windows 7. And for my serial hack, I just use my XBee with com2tcp on Windows 7 with a custom .BAT file that runs the correct settings for forwarding my COM port to a TCP port for connecting with TeraTerm. And on XP I use HyperTerminal. Cheers, Jamie Kugelmann

 

Hi Jamie,

    Thanks for explaining....of course I forgot that you dont need VSP for USBConsole (but you do need it for RSMRemote).

    Just out of interest -For your XBee why do you need com2tcp? Cant teraterm connect straight to the ComPort?

 

Gerber, As Jaime has remineded me of how it works !!- If you just want to use USBConsole ,you dont have to use the VSP. Just use teraterm and connect with setting TCP/IP ,Service =Telnet , Port = 222.  Sorry I should have told you this before....:-(

 

BTW I resolved my issue with VSPE (It was actually an operator problem (primarily I forgot how to setup the Incoming Connection manager properly!!)) From more testing it seems that HWGroup VSPV3 is working fine (and faster than VSPE) so I will continue with this. Getting close now - I hope I can release a set of instructions for "Networking over USB" in the not too distant future....

Cheers

   Helibot

gerber
gerber's picture

Cheers Jamie, Vader helibot for the help. I will try all commands tonight and will let you know how I get on.

I had the Main Robot board back from my work college today and I quote what he said "It's like looking for a needle in a hey stack without the circuit drawing". I will continue to try and find the fault myself, but I fear the amount of time it is going to take to check all of the components I will probably be 156years old before I finished.(It would be a lot easy if there was a sign of a burnt or damaged component, at least I would have somewhere to start looking) Does anyone have any ideas on the best course of action in order to find a faulty component/components on this board, or am I looking for a needle in a hey stack as my work college said? Is it a lost cause and am I likely to loose my hair before I find the fault(BTW I am mostly bald anyway so it won't take much for me to loose the rest of my hair)? I would really appriciate any suggestions anyone has.

Cheers
Gerber

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hey Gerber,
Here are a few suggestions for you (these are untried and off the top of my head):-
1) Power the robot via a bench supply or through a multimeter and see if it is drawing much current (ie 600mA-1Amp during inital startup?). If it is then see if any components are getting hot?
2) Many of the problems seen by others on the main board are the drive transistors dying. So you could use a multimeter and check the resistance of each transistor - compare it to other transistors and see if any are very different (eg short circuit or different resistance ) to others ones of the same make. It would actually be better if you measured resistance of transistors in your good board and compared it to the same transistor on the bad board.

Cheers
Helibot

gerber
gerber's picture

Hi

@Helibot - cheers for that I will try it and check the board as you have advised.

Cheers @Vader and @Helibot said. It's fantastic the RSM is now working in realtimeLaughing. Cheers for the help both. I will probably ask lots more questions about programming, but for now I am going to create a crude graphic interface to control the robot  to move the arms and other body parts then I will move on the RSM musical instrument idea I had.

Cheers Gerber

 

 

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Hi Gerber, I had totally forgot about the sensors bugging the control when you asked yesterday, so sorry. It's the first thing I do almost blindly (send the eyes ans ears off command) So it totally slipped my mind. And in regards to the testing the components on your bad bot, how I mentioned to you before and how Helibot is advising, if you measured resistance of transistors in your good board and compared it to the same transistor on the bad board you may find something there. Happy hunting

Freddy

Vader
Vader's picture

@gerber - If you want to avoid turning his vision and hearing off but still be able to control him, you can paste this into the terminal:

echo "1" > /tmp/state/scriptrun
/usr/bin/robot/pipe /tmp/robot_pipe 9 2 0 0 0

I *think* this will stop him from tracking etc since it is run at the start of every macro. To reverse (so you don't have a zombie bot) you can use this:

/usr/bin/robot/pipe /tmp/robot_pipe 9 2 1 0 0
echo "0" > /tmp/state/scriptrun

Jamie
Jamie's picture

Hello Helibot,

 

I need com2tcp for my XBee because on Windows 7, my XBee COM port is COM7, and TeraTerm can only go up to COM4. On Windows XP, I just use HyperTerminal and connect straight to my COM port. (COM3)

 

Cheers,

 

Jamie Kugelmann

gerber
gerber's picture

@vader - cheers for that. I have had a quick look at some of the default .sh files and notice they are using these commands you mentioned.

I have another question how do I upload and download files to the robot from the PC. I know I can do this by physically by putting the SD card into the PC then copy the files in windows explorer, but what I really want to be able to do is copy the file in the console as code.

My question is the actual linux command to transfer the files in hyperterminal? Also do I have to mount the drive PC drive before transfer file. If so how do I do this?

Is there a document with all the robot codes for the pipe command available? I have downloaded the RS_Macro_editor version 1.3 along with document which contains some of the commands used to get the robot to perform actions. I'm a bit confused about some of figures on the end of each command. For example in the command "/usr/bin/robot/pipe /tmp/robot_pipe 9 2 0 0 0" what does the "9 2 0 0 0" mean. I know they are parameters but what is each number for? If there is a document does it also have the format of the of the the statements such as If, while etc. As from my experience the format for code changes from one software language to another. Basicly I am asking is the a comprehensive programming manual or document which describing all command and what parameters are used for?

what does the following commands do?
echo "1" > /tmp/state/scriptrun
echo "0" > /tmp/state/scriptrun

I am really greatful for the help so far.

Cheers
Gerber

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Gerber,
I can answer some of your questions....
If you have serial hack then you can easily use linux command 'zmrx' and then on Teraterm use "File:Transfer:ZModem:Send". BUT note that you MUST be in a directory that you have write access to (I usually use cd /tmp first.) Then if uyou want to execute the file you transferred you need to use chmod 777 .
If you have USBConsole then the ZModem transfer may work... but you may find it locks up often (it maybe ok for small files).
You can also edit files in the robot using 'vi' editor (again works fine for serial console, may work ok for the USB console)
You can make the SDCard writeable with
/bin/mount /dev/mmc /mnt/sd -o rw,remount
but its advisable to use the 'sync' command after you have edited any file (the sync command ensures all data is actually permantly written to the SDCard)
(BTW if you are using the USB console you cant use USB massstorage acess from the PC)

>Is there a document with all the robot codes for the pipe command available?
Unfortunately no. SantaMatts list of commands (which I think you already have) is fairly comprenhensive to explain most of the known commands and movements.

>what does the "9 2 0 0 0" mean.
No one knows exactaly what these commands mean :-(
From our guesses so far, it seems that these commands tell the Robot board to change some behaviour, but we dont know the details.
It seems that "9 2 0 0 0" is used to tell teh robot board that the Media board will be doing a set of commands now (like a macro/bodycon) and the robot board will prevent any other types of responses from happening (eg flinch,IR tracking, react to sound etc).

>Basicly I am asking is the a comprehensive programming manual or document
> which describing all command and what parameters are used for?
Unfortunately there is no comprehensive manual. Much of the information has never been published by Wowwee.

>echo "1" > /tmp/state/scriptrun
This line simply puts "1" into the file /tmp/state/scriptrun. Then other scripts can test the value in this file to see if the activity is running.
The default programs and scripts do this quite a lot.
There are also files in /tmp/state/XXXXX that hold values for the states of all the buttons and IR sensors etc. Then there are small programs that scripts can run to get the values from the file. These programs are in \usr\bin\robot\state\XXXXX. (It is actually a bit more complex than what I just explained - and I cant remember all the details now:-( - I think I have it in notes somewhere and its been discussed on a thread as well...but I cant remember which one at the moment! Let me know if you want any more info and I will try to dig it up.)

Cheers
Helibot

gerber
gerber's picture

@helibot - cheers for the answer.

It is great help that other in the forum have already put alot of the hard work and research in find the so much about the commands and functions of the robot. It's just a shame wowwee won't release some documentation as the robot is no long being manufactured.

So basically with respect transfering files to and from the PC it is better for me to add the serial hack mod. I have one on order that jamie sent me the link for. I have downloaded instruction to update the firmware to v2 you wrote @helibot. Once I add the serial hack do I have to upgrade the firmware inorder to be able to use it or will I be able to communicate with the robot from the pc through the serial hack without the firmware upgrade?

Cheers
Gerber

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Gerber,
>It's just a shame wowwee won't release some documentation as the robot is no long being manufactured.
Yes , we all feel the same :-(. We could do so much more with extra information!.

>So basically with respect transfering files to and from the PC it is better for me to add the serial hack mod.
I would try it with USBConsole first, if you are transferring small files it may work OK for you.
Also I will be releasing a better version of 'Networking over USB' soon. When that is running you can do file transfer with TFTP or FTP and have multiple telnet/console windows open at one time. So it should make development and tinkering a lot easier. BUT you will need a RSM V2 for it to work.

By the way I usually have serial console as may primary way of doing things, but I also have the USB console setup as well. This is handy because from the seecond console you can look at files/states and run other tests while testing scripts or programs started from the serial console. Its also really handy when your program/script goes wrong and you cant get back to the prompt. You can use ps and kill commands to kill the script/program. (This saves me from having to reboot the robot so much!!)

>Do I have to upgrade the firmware in order to be able to use serial console.
You can use the serial console on RSMV1 OR RSMV2. You only need RSMV2 for 'Networking over serial' or 'Networking over USB'.

Cheers
Helibot

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Hi Helibot and Rudolph, I've put this list together but need to clear up a couple of things before I order.
First for the capacitor: 100uf 16v
http://au.mouser.com/Passive-Components/_/N-5g73?Keyword=Kemet%2c+100Uf+...
How many ohms is that?

then the parts for the motor board:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/STMicroelectronics/2SD882/?qs=sGAEpi...

http://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/STMicroelectronics/2SB772/?qs=7kmgJcy...
I'm guessing about 8 of each of these?

And the part fried on the main board.
http://au.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=SPX3819M5-L-5-0

And could you please link me also to the needed resisitors on mouser. Thanks

Freddy

gerber
gerber's picture

Hi all

I have to apologise as I have only just realised that I am starting to dominating this thread with a lot of programming question when this thread was really intended for broke robots.

I have start to write some software for the RS Media which I have named “RS Media Control Station”.

If you are wanting to find out more about the new software I am developing and my other ideas for the RS Media (hopefully none of which are too insane) then please click on link below to get to the new thread I have started below:

http://www.robocommunity.com/forum/thread/18008/-RS-Media-Control-Station-software/

Anyway back to the reason this thread was started.
I have chase up the purchasing department at my place of work about the parts I was going to try and source for you Freddy. Unfortunately they still haven’t got around to trying to get them for me as they are still very busy with a lot of new orders. They have apologised and said they will get some sample as soon as they have a spare moment.

I have now named my daughters broken robot FRANKENSTIEN’S MONSTERSurprised as I think he may need a bolt of lightning to get him working again. I am still trying to find the fault on the main robot board.

Will keep you posted on my progress

Cheers
Gerber

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Freddy,
Regarding the capicitor - I dont think the Ohm/ESR matters very much in this case (I think its more relevent for ccts with high frequency switching??.) So I think this one will be good :-http://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Kemet/T495C107K016ZTE200/?qs=sGAEpiMZ...
The motor board transistors look correct. I would suggest to replace them in pairs, so buy the same number of each. BTW As previously discussed I would love it if you could buy about 4 each of these for me!!.

For the 27K resistor choose a metal film 1/4watt 1% like this one
http://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/KOA-Speer/MF1-4DCT52R2702F/?qs=sGAEpi...

For the 56K resistor choose a metal film 1/4watt 1% like this one
http://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/KOA-Speer/MF1-4DC5602F/?qs=sGAEpiMZZM...

Cheers
Helibot

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Helibot, I ran into a snag. Take a look at the picture showing the pads for the regulator on the main board, looks to me like the bottom right pad has a solder jumper accross to the pad for the component to the right of it. That micro component looks bad also so i'll have to get that one too. Any Ideas what it is?

Also, I replaced the burned transistors and capacitor.

While I was doing this i found another solder jumper take a look

 

I'll take another RSM apart to compare but what do you think about those jumpers?

EDIT: just compared with a USA version and no jumpers at these two points.

freddy

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Freddy,
The small component (that you put a red box around) is a capacitor. The white writing next to it says C173. (C is always for capacitors, R is always for resistors.) On the left hand side of the red boxes you can see '172'. ( I guess it actually says C172 but the C is covered up by the hotglue.)
The actual C172 capicitor is exactly to the left of the red boxes. It would be a good guess that the C172 and C173 are probably the same capacitors. So you could remove C172 and measure its capacitance with a meter and buy one of the same value.

Regarding the solder links. Often its a case that there is actually a track underneath the solder link and the solder just flows to form what looks like a solder link. So I would remove the solder (with a sucker or a braid and see if there is a track underneath. If there is no track then leave it off. It would be unlikely that wowwee would goto production using hand placed solder links (If they did need to put a link in , its more likely they would put a bit of wire there as well.)
Anyway it seems that you compared it to another one and they shouldnt be there. (Sorry I havent got a bot open (or photographs) that I can easily check with. But if you still want me to I can open mine up - just let me know).
Is it possible you (or someone else) made the links accidentaly when removing or replacing the other components?

Cheers
Helibot

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Hi Helibot, I think the same way, unlikely WowWee had to use solder jumpers although I have seen them on RSM with a wire jumper. Anyhow my guess is that those jumpers caused the problems to begin with. As they were there before I started my own repairs. I'll clean them up and search for that capacitor.

Freddy

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Well here is another jumper, this one is wire, i dont know how I missed it before. Anyhow the other ones looked nothing like this one so they got removed.

Huge crator from the explosion and one of the "legs" from the component was fused to the gold at the solder pad, and that one does does have an underlaying track to the lower pad for the capacitor that also blew.

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Freddy,
The 'wire link' looks intentional , Id leave it there.

That crator looks bad.....if its gone too deep you caould be in trouble, I guess the board is multi layer, which means it will have multiple layers of tracks. Some layers will be be signals and some will be power or ground planes. So if the crator is too deep it can break (or short) the tracks and ground planes on the internal layers. You should check for shorts between the tracks and power and gnd. And also check the resistance b/n pwr & gnd and compare it to a good board...make sure they are mostly similar.

This board looks like its had one hell of a hard life ....I really hope you get it going again!!.

Cheers
Helibot

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

He Lives Again. Yes, after replacing parts on every board it came time to power up the bot, and power up it did. The neck motor sounded stressed and then a small swirl of smoke appeared AH! from where!? I shut the bot off and started sniffing and touching around. Ouch! the two transistors next to the ones I changed were burning hot. Pulled those out and replaced them. And now neck motor sounds strong and smooth and robot boots up. I noticed the new motor & grease smell. This particular RSM wasn't used at all, I can imagine it was unboxed and a 12v adapter was the first juice it had. Poof, it blew just after power button was pushed and never got to do its start up routine.
I'll tell you what Helibot, that mickey mouse part I got to replace the burned voltage regulator was so tiny that the resistors were huge compared and there was some serious precision soldering, a real challenge. I'll post a picture of the mess tomorrow. SO he is revived! Thanks to all for the help and suggestions. And a special thanks to you Helibot.

Freddy

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hey Freddy, thats fantasic, what a recovery.... great job.
I guessed your 3D soldering job was going to be a bit tricky!! But it may have been even harder with the tiny resistors - they are hard to hold when not being put on surface mount pads! Cant wait to see the photos.
Did you check the output volatge of the new regulator? Was it sitting at the correct 3.8volts?

>I can imagine it was unboxed and a 12v adapter was the first juice it had
Wow it did a lot of damage for just a few volts over!!
What about the solder bridge you found and removed? Could they have been the cause of inital problems? (Or do you think they may have occured later as someone tried to fix it?)

I'm also really glad that the motor drive transistors worked OK as well.....that means I should be able to revive my neck motor when I get some!.

Cheers
Helibot

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Hi Helibot, tricky indeed. I didnt check the voltage, I just plugged in power and prayed. I suppose the adapter that was plugged in could have more voltage, but also the solder jumper cross the transistor pins would have done something. This robot wasnt opened after it was assembled at factory I can tell, I'm like a detective looking for clues. BTW you should have those transistors soon.

 

then with hot glue

 

I had to test him with his head upside down as his severed ribbon cables dont reach to connect. Lucky I found some ribbons on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280536789310&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

 

Jamie
Jamie's picture

Hello Freddy,

Congratulations on fixing your dead robot!!!
You did the best job I've ever seen and you've done something no one has done ever before. You should be proud.
Very good soldering and again congratulations Freddy!!!

Hope you have learnt a lot and everyone else can learn from you!

Cheers,

Jamie Kugelmann

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi Freddy,
Nice Job with the soldering. Looks good. Love that upside down head photo....imagine how confused the software would be in tracking mode...left is right and up is down....could be enough to make another short circuit!

>I didnt check the voltage, I just plugged in power and prayed.
Thats must have been a tense moment!! (Especilly when you saw the smoke!!)
You could have also layed him down for the first power up - this would stop him moving too many motors , then you can use the remote to move him a limb at a time.
>I suppose the adapter that was plugged in could have more voltage, but also the solder jumper cross the transistor pins would have done something.
I would have thought that b4 shipping he would have been poweredup and run though a selftest sort of sequence. So I am surprised that damage from the solder link wouldnt have been caused then and caused him to fail? Maybe it was only triggered when a particular motor was run? Do you know which motor the shorted transistor wwould drive?

>BTW you should have those transistors soon.
Thanxxxxxx heaps Freddy, cant wait to put them in and see if his head works again. But I think I still have a busted gear in the up/down head movement :-(, so will have to tray and fix that while he is apart.

Cheers
Helibot

gerber
gerber's picture

Hi Freddy

Excellent work on getting the robot back to life. The head looks great upside down. It makes the RSM look like he's wearing a aircraft pilot's helment and breathing mask. Freddy is this the first development stages of making him into the first every RSM aircraft pilot? Obviously as helibot said it must be pretty confusing for the RSM, up being down and left being right, so maybe if he did become the first ever RSM pilot his first flight would probably be his last due to his orientation problems and the poor old RSM pilot would die in his efforts trying to become a flying ace Cry!! Eeeek!!! Probably best to keep him grounded or at least fit him with a parachute maybe!

Cheers
Gerber

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Thanks guys I enjoyed doing the work and am super stoked it was worth it. @helibot, the robot goes nuts trying to follow me with his eyes and doesnt stop, I turned his eyes off to calm him down. It was the neck motor transistor that had that solder link and all 4 transistors were bad.
@Gerber yeah I thought the same about the head looking like a facemask after I finished connecting it. You have a mission Gerber. Your ging to have to send a RSM up in the air somehow and that is final.
@Jamie YO.

gerber
gerber's picture

Hi Freddy

Yes your right I am going to make a flying RSM, but  first I think will need to finish fixing my daughters RSM. My daughter keeps asking if it is fixed yet. I haven’t the heart to tell her that I haven’t touched it for a few weeks, but I did promise her I will do my very best to fix it.

The reason I haven’t looked at robot's fault for a few weeks is because I’ve been working of the RSM Control station software and also I have been trying to learn more about electronics so I can understand more about the components on the fault board and what they actually do. I have been teaching myself about electrionics by making a Audio control servo driver board from components I have salvaged from work. My plan is to use this board to drive a motorised mouth I will fit in front of the RSM face so when a sound is played on the RSM's speaker the mouth will move. Once I have made this I should know a little bit more about electrics then I will try and fix the robot and then, choc’s away the first flying robot development will start.

Hold on a minute “WHAT AM I SAYING!!!!” Foot in mouthI don’t think making my daughter’s robot fly would be a good idea as she will be quite upset if he decides to fly off, leave homeand never return. So maybe Freddy you will need continue in the development of yours first and in you design can you please add some kind of mechanism to automatically get him to return home. Once you have done this I am definitely on board with the idea and I will then make one myself and you never know maybe we could have them meet up in mid air over the Atlantic Ocean and send video feedback to us. How cool would that be. Anyway as you have already started with your mod for the RSM by make his head into aircraft pilot's helmet I really think you should carry on. Hee Hee!

Oh yes I should have the next release of the RS Media Contol Station ready by the end of the weekend hopefully. I have added all the movements for the robots limbs into the software now and have sorted out some of the bug I found in the first release. As soon as it’s done I will upload it to the forum.

Cheers Gerber

FreddyA
FreddyA's picture

Hi gerber looking forward to your next software release and hope you get your daughters RSM working. For right now my RSMs are grounded, they have to be able to at least carry on a pretend conversation before I send them up to meet the aliens.

Freddy

hayzb88
hayzb88's picture

hi peeps is anyone around still that can help me. My son got a rsm off his dad but his dad put the wrong charger in and saw smoke come out of the robot. Weve put brand new batteries in the feet and it turned on said hello but then told us the batteries were dying and shut off. can anyone help me with this please. ive seen your posts about the capacitor and wondered if this is the problem. thanks in advanced 

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