RS media waist problem

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nomad
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helibot he knows rsm inside out.good post

LBMebia
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thats what ive read so im a bit hesitant. Heres the other link..

http://www.robocommunity.com/forum/thread/18065/Reflashing-RSMedia-V2-wi...

im trying to find out how i can actually check which version and upgrade it to the RSM2...

Thanks for sending the springs, i eagerly await..

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

yeah, ive seen some of his threads.. he definely knows alot.. He is still active on this forum.. havent seen alot of updated post. Would like his advice on that topic.

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Do you know any reliable people who wants to sell me a rs media or robosapien V2 robot at a reasonble price.. Cant find anybody on the forum. Ebay would be my last stop..

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi LBMebia,

   Got your PM...so I have stopped by to see if I can help :-)
Some initial thoughts for you:
  -From all the issues I have seen (myself and others posts) when a robot doesn't move limbs properly it is almost always mechanical or electrical problem.  So I would not look at reloading his firmware yet - focus on mechanical then electrical first.

 -When you manually tilt him left and right can you hear motors/gears whirring? (as well as creaks?). You should be able to hear motor+gears moving.

-Try taking the springs off and manually tilt him left and right. Do the creaking sounds stop? (This will prove if its the springs creaking).

 -Have you tried swapping the springs over , then see if the stalling or spring sounds stay on the same sides or move. (But you will need to turn him back on to check this)

 

To answer some of your questions (from PM):
>I would like some of your advice on how to Check and upgrade to RSM2.
See thread How-to-check-if-your-RSMedia-is-V1-or-V2/ for how to check.

and see thread Reflashing-RSMedia-V2 for reflashing a V2.

and see thread Reflashing-RSMedia-with-original-firmware for reflashing a V1.
(But as I said before I suspect that its a mechanical or electrical issue). 

Cheers
  Helibot

Helibot
Helibot's picture

>If i put his body back to straight postion and tap the arm movements (L) it goes to the 90 degree angle immediately.
I dont think your waist twisting problem will be a spring issue.
The way it should work is this.
1) Body is straight
2) press the L button and tap the left direction button on left side of the remote.
3) Body should spin left to 45 degrees.
4) tap the button again.
5) Body should spin left to 90 degrees.
6) press the L button and tap the right direction button on left side of the remote.
7) Body should spin back to front (0 degrees).
(So body does NOT go back to 45 deg on the way back!)

The robot has sensors to detect which position the body is in. And I guess that your sensor may be working correctly. So when he starts up he thinks he is already twisted and moves to try and straighten himself.
Maybe look for a loose or broken wire? Unfortunately I dont know where the sensors are for the waist , so cant tell you any more :-(

Cheers
Helibot

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Hi, thanks for your advise..you seem to be spot on.. One of the problems is, when he boots up as you mentioned he goes immediately to my left, his right.
If i straighten him and tap any of the L buttons he goes immediately to the his right.. As for the springs, i removed them and the creaking sound was gone..definetely a spring sound.
When i move his body with or without springs, left to right up or down i hear the motors..no funny or unusual sounds, just the motors winding.
At this point im leaning towards an electrical problem but cant be sure.
After he goes into a 90degree angle he cant go back to straight. although arms,legs etc works fine.

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi LBMebia,

Great to know that the creaky sound was just the springs. And Nomad has sent you some new ones!! (Good one Nomad:-) )

I still think your waist twist sensor is not reading right and causing the 90Deg turn issue. I dont have an RSMedia apart to suggest where to look (I also looked at other photos that have been posted, but cant spot anything to help you. ) Anyone else listening that can help with this?
LBMebia - if you take some close up photos of the area (take one of teh hips from the front and of the gears that drive the twisiting) , I might be able to tell further just by seeing them.

You also said that "The L and R tilt buttons doesnt work." I guess you mean that if you hold L button and press right /left direction keys on right control pad that he does nothing. When he should tilt to left or right. Does this also mean he does not tilt left and right during the startup animation?
Not sure why this would be, probably electrical if he doesnt make any noise/movement at all. I would guess/hope its a different problem to the 90 deg turn issue.

Cheers
helibot

nomad
nomad's picture

does v2 has same twist sensor?

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Yes, exactly..once you tap L/R he goes immediately to 90Deg.After that only his arms, voice works. but his twisting movement left to right up/down does not. i can also hear the motor winding when he struck in 90Deg. Im in the process of putting him back together to show you guys what happens..

nomad
nomad's picture

great job

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Where can i chat about the versions V1/V2. Been reading Helibots post about upgrading etc. i want to know if its a huge difference to upgrade to V2. Also, about any additions addons. Im hopeful that this issue will be fixed.

Rs media might be old in most countries but where im from people are not aware of wow wee toys and interest is very limited for robotics etc.

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Just thought id divert in the interim of putting him back together. I wanted to know by peoples person experience if its worth it. Read the documents of differces...

nomad
nomad's picture

here's best place for it.you can ask helibot-curtainmaker-and some others too.
just place your questions here.and topic v1 or v2

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Thanks Nomad. Well, Firstly as im a newbie is it a great idea to upgrade TO v2.

Second, Ive, read a whole lot of different post of things to do with the RSM like this
http://www.robocommunity.com/forum/thread/18143/Santa-exists.-It-s-True-... which sounds very interesting but is there some guideline or process of some sort "best" way to install/flash all these things. Or do i just go ahead in install anything at anytime.

Thirdly, whats the best method to use to unput files,voices etc, like the above link from Gerber or the good old RSM suite which seems limiting.

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi LBMebia,
Here is some background on extras for RSMedia and what you can do with them.
There are three main ways to get extra functionality on you RSMedia
1) USB Console- Allows basic access to linux commands on RSMedia from a computer via USB cable (can be done on RSMV1 or V2 sw)
2) Serial Hack- Allows much better/faster/reliable access to linux console on RSMedia from a computer (can be done on RSMV1 or V2 sw)
3) Networking- Allows a network connection to be made from RSMedia to a computer. (can ONLY be done on RSMV2)

To run the RSM Control station you only need a serial connection, so it can be done from RSMV1. It works best via the serial hack (but it can be done using USB console, but it's a bit complex to setup and not so reliable or fast).
Note that you will need the serial hack to complete the RSMV1 to RSMV2 upgrade.

So I would recommend doing the serial hack if you really want to take advantage of advanced features like RSM control station and networking.

As you have found some other users have written special programs for RSMedia. These can all connect using just the serial connection (ie after serial hack is done on RSMV1 or RSMV2). Some will also connect over networking (and may provide some extra features):
RSMedia Control Station by Gerber
RSMedia Terminal Console by Gerber
RSMRemote by Vader
See the downloads area for most of these : http://www.robocommunity.com/download/list?sort=date&cat=12

Whats the difference between RSM V1 and RSM V2 software versions?
1) RSMV1 has no capability todo network connections to another computer.
2) RSMV2 has the capability todo network connections to another computer (via serial port or via USB cable)
3) RSMV2 has an extra menu in the MedialMode:Options menu called "USB Net".
4) All other software and robot capabilities are the same for RSMV1 and RSMV2.

So what can you do with the network connections on RSMV2 software?
1) It allows connections to be made from RSM to another computer.
2) Connections can be made via USB cable (ie the normal cable that comes with RSMedia)
3) Connections can be made via Serial connection (ie Serial connection is available once the serial hack is done - the connection to the computer can then be by special cable or via wireless adapter.)
4) Once a connection is made you can do the following:
a. Remote console -you can access to RSMedia linux console to issue Linux commands directly to the robot.
b. FTP server can be run on RSMedia - This allows files to be easily copied to and from RSMedia.
c. Web server can be run on RSMedia- This allows RSMedia to create web pages himself , then from your PC browser (or even the internet!) you can see the web pages.

What are the steps to get to running Networking connections?
1) If you have a RSMV1 then you need to do the upgrade to RSMV2 software.
2) To do the upgrade you MUST have the serial hack.
3) Once you have RSMV2 software, you only need to copy the correct files on the SDCard and boot RSMedia.
4) Then you can setup the computer to allow networking and make the connection with RSMedia.
5) Then you can use ftp/web/telnet or other programs.

(I dont think this info is available in one place....maybe I should put this in a new thread so its easy for others to find!! Should also include links to the different important threads!)

To directly answer your questions:
"but is there some guideline or process of some sort "best" way to install/flash all these things. Or do i just go ahead in install anything at anytime."
As above I recommend todo the serial hack first, as many of the other things require/work best with the serial hack.

"whats the best method to use to unput files,voices etc, like the above link from Gerber or the good old RSM suite which seems limiting."
RSMSuite is limiting, Gerbers tool is good but requires serial connection. So RSMSuite is easisest to start with. You can actually manually copy files to the SDCard (via SDCard reader on the PC) - This is the way I usually change things on RSMedia.

Cheers
Helibot

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi again,
You said " i can also hear the motor winding when he struck in 90Deg." Do you mean it is running all the time? Or that it makes sound while moving to 90deg then stops?.
If its moving all the time then thats not good, you should avoid doing this very much. It could create more electrical (if motor is running and drawing too much current) or mechanical issues (if something is being stressed it could cause problems like stripping gears or stressing/breaking plastic parts).

Cheers
Helibot

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Thanks for all the info Helibot, its much appreciated. So from what ive read its a good idea to upgrade to RSMV2..A So basically first :

Check which version you are running
Serial hack process
upgrade to RSM V2

As for the motor winding, it only does that when i press the button to try to get him back to straight. So i guess as you mention this would then be a good thing that it DOES stop spinning.

The things id like to do if possible is voice recognition, receiving messages throught RSM, facial recognition.. So the question is, Is it possible ?

Again thanks for your support Helibot

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

I also just read up on Copybot.. Are you able to move your head and or other body parts (I saw you only mentioned arms which is really cool)..

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Sorry, forget the last post, i read the file..

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Helibot, you might just get a little annoyed by my question/questions.. Please humour me.

Again, ive seen pics the serial hack on RSM..soldering the wires to the board.
Firstly, is there a more simpler to get the serial hack and/or a way to achieve voice recognition, receiving messages throught RSM, facial recognition, copybot type of mods.. Im really not that interested in internet,skype mods for now..

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hi LBMebia,
No worries with the questions. I like helping out with anything RSMedia related. And happy to see any one enthused about it!!

Your steps are correct :Check which version you are running,Serial hack process, upgrade to RSM V2.

>Firstly, is there a more simpler to get the serial hack and/or a way to achieve
>voice recognition, receiving messages throught RSM, facial recognition, copybot type of mods.
The USBConsole achieves the same thing as the serial hack, and it doesnt need a hardware mod, but its not as reliable or fast as serial hack.
Some mods (like copy bot, RSMalarmclock) can be done without the serial hack. These involve installing things onto RSMedia (usually via adding custom Bodycons or creating a custom boot script on the SDCard ). Other Mods - mostly ones that are more interactive require the serial hack (or at least USBConsole).

If you want an good mod to start with then try USBConsole and then setup Text-to-Speech (so RSMedia will speak the words you type on your computer keyboard). It would be a good way to ramp up and is great fun when you can make RSMedia say anything you like!

BTW - Facial or body movement recognition has not been done on Rs Media. Its probably possible but would be difficult to achieve. Basic voice recognition is partly done - except that we cant find a way to easily record a sound from the microphone :-(.
CopyBot uses the infrared sensors to simply detect if something is close on the right side or close on the left side. So it wouldn't work well to try and detect head movement - you would really need to use the camera and analyse the video screens todo this.

Cheers
Helibot

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Ok nice, all this info is just giving me a feel of the do`s/dont.
One more question, how and what/where can i, do i get USBconsole to work. I want to get some of your things working to have some fun.

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture
Helibot
Helibot's picture

 

LBMebia said: Just had a look at this now http://www.robocommunity.com/download/17231/RSMedia-USBConsole/

 

Cool, you found it. Most of the bigger RSM mods/programs I have done are in the downlaod part of this forum. 

But for even more you can see the RSMedia Developemnt Kit website on Sourceforge.
http://sourceforge.net/projects/rsmediadevkit/

It contains many downloads and source code for all  the RSMedia work I  (and some others) have released.

It also has a website with lots of information about RSMedia. (Most of this info was pulled togehter by TikaC and myself)

Actually it has a slightly updated version of USB console here. Version 1.5.1.

Cheers

   Helibot

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Hey there, i came accross your and TikaC website before i came here and was very interested in the mods.
I just read the USB console README file and i got to be honest its mind boggling.
I need to read more for now..
Almost done putting back the big guy.. Will let you guys know asap

Helibot
Helibot's picture

Hey LBmebia,

>I just read the USB console README file and i got to be honest its mind boggling.
Yeah , the doc is a bit complex - to be honest I think the doc could be better written (and probably needs to be updated for Win7 as well!).
But I am happy to help if needed.

I had one more thought to help get your robot useable. Most of the motors for RSMedia are held in with straps, so you could find the waist motor and undo the strap and slide the morot out. The motor would still spin but it wont actually drive any gears so your bot would not spin to 90 degrees. It may allow you to make the robot more useable.

Also I had a thought about the waist tilt. You said yours is not working right? I wonder if this will affect his walking gait? I think that the bot may tilt left and right to help balance during walking. ( I cant test this at the moment cos I only have DC power supply on mine at the moment and he only walks when on batteries :-) )

Cheers
Helibot.

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

Hey..WOW WOO WOW.. I Just finished put him back together and guess what, HE WORKS properly..

Firstly, i took the springs and moved him to hear for any other sounds,creaks etc (heard nothing).Waist Motors sounded good
Switched the springs around to see if the spring sounds dissapered, it didnt but still left it like that.
I had a look at the sensors on his chest (At least i think they are sensors) metal thingy that runs accross his chest an waist area. I saw that the sensors on his chest had grease on it and the waist had nothing(I dont know if this was the best thing to do but i put a little grease on the waist sensors)
I moved him up,down left to right just to try to loosen him up. i Also never made the springs too tight as they very tight when i initially took them off.

Thats about it.. charged batteries full and he works.

The springs needs replacing as i can still hear then as he turns. Also one of the springs are more stiffer.

Thanks to Nomad i await a spare set.

nomad
nomad's picture

heya hoya heya hoya ,great job.

LBMebia
LBMebia's picture

I HAVE TO GIVE A SPECIAL THANKS TO NOMAD AND HELIBOT FOR ASSISTING ME AND PUTTING UP WITH "NEWBIE" QUESTIONS. ITS MUST APPRECIATED GUYS..

I WILL CONTINUE TO SUPPORT THE FORUM IN ANY WAY POSSIBLE.

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